This transcript has been generated by AI - apologies for any mistakes

Pippa Goulden (00:44)
Emma Thomas is an executive coach, menopause educator, facilitator and podcaster. Her work centers around how we navigate the midlife collision of careers, family, health and identity. After a long career in publishing, her experience of redundancy booted her out of comfort and complacency. And as part of her own midlife pivot, she started her own company and retrained, all whilst navigating her own midlife collision of kids, elderly parents, perimenopause symptoms and a never ending to-do list.

Her podcast, Middling Along, has been voted one of the top 25 in the midlife and menopause space, and she's been described as a beacon of inspiration in a world of menopause fear and misinformation. She has done a brilliant job of getting known for what she does, and we are going to deep dive into exactly how she's done that now.

Pippa Goulden (01:29)
So welcome Emma to PR Made Simple. How are you doing?

Emma (01:32)
Thank you for inviting me along.

Pippa Goulden (01:33)
I'm so pleased you're here. I'm looking forward to deep diving into everything that you do, because it is just absolutely brilliant and something that lots of people need to be aware of. Tell us in more detail. I've obviously given you a quick overview, but tell us about what you do and how you've got to where you are today.

Emma (01:50)
So I am aware of a few hats. I am an executive coach. So I work one-to-one with individuals, but also with teams, do a bit of facilitation work as well on that side of things. have a part of my business, which is corporate facing menopause training awareness, training line managers, working with companies that want to be more menopause inclusive.

also run a podcast called Middling Along that's been going for about five years for sort of women in the messy middle bit of life and that's how I sort of ended up really working in that area which we can come back to maybe. But actually my background really for a long time was in academic publishing so I've got about 30 years which makes me feel very old.

under my belt of working in a whole range of different functions in academic publishing from editorial through sort of sales, production, and then more laterally sort of working more in sort of systems and processes, which I think is, I think my brain's quite kind of geared to that kind of stuff. So kind of zone of genius. And then, yeah, got made redundant, threw everything up in the air.

Pippa Goulden (02:57)
Amazing.

see what lands. So you're a podcaster, a coach, a community leader. How do you wear so many hats and how do you focus on looking at your profile and getting known for what you do and what you actually do? How do you wear those hats?

Emma (03:13)
If I'm completely honest, quite haphazardly, there's a lot of making up as I go along. I don't think if you'd asked me 10 years ago, what I would be doing, any of this would have been on my radar at all. And so really, I think a lot of what I have ended up doing has been me following

my passion and my interest. And so at the moment I'm really very much figuring out how those pieces fit together. And I think for a while I was almost apologetic about the fact that I was wearing all of these different hats. But actually, when I sort of step back and think about it, actually there are things that I am learning in those different guises that inform.

some of my other work. And so for me, it does make sense. I would ideally like to have a few extra hours in every day, but wouldn't we all so that I could actually get through my big long to-do list. Cause when you're sort of effectively being four or five different people, it can get a little bit unmanageable, but yeah, I'm a big lover of lists and trying to implement better systems.

Pippa Goulden (04:21)
well, I think most most of us who are on this entrepreneurial journey identify with that. That's for sure. I think one of the things you've done really well, I mean, it's not just any podcast. It is one of the leading menopause podcasts and you've been doing it for how long have you been doing it for now?

Emma (04:35)
So we're recording this in September and around about this time of year, five years ago was when the idea came together. I was thinking initially about writing a blog and then a couple of people said to me, well, why don't you do it as a podcast?

And at the time I just thought that was a ridiculous idea because I didn't know anything about podcasting at all. Like, well, how on earth am I going to do that? Right? That's beyond the realms of possibility. And then so I've looked into it a little bit more. My husband's quite technical, so I had kind of chatted to him, went away and found a kind of a very low cost course that I took. Bought myself the secondhand microphone that I'm still using now.

and just kind of jumped in and learned as I go. as you know, I say to people, like you don't have, you can learn as you go. you can start kind of messy. Start before you're ready. Don't wait until you're ready. You're never gonna be ready. There's no such thing. And actually, you know, if you kind of pre-varicate around something like that, then maybe you'll never do it at all.

Pippa Goulden (05:37)
Yeah, absolutely. You've just got to jump in sometimes, haven't you? And I think, you know, the menopause space over the last five years has absolutely boomed. And for you to become a leading podcast in that space, you you attract some amazing guests. You've always got such an interesting angle and new ways of looking at things, which isn't easy when the conversations are taking place in lots of different places. what's your approach to the podcasting side of it?

Emma (06:01)
So similarly, I guess to sort of, know, how did I end up here? That's how I approach the podcast. You know, it is what, what am I interested in? What do I want to know as a woman in midlife? What, what do I care about? What are the actually, you know, what, what's different about what this person is kind of bringing to the conversation? And I think you're right that the conversation has moved on so much in that five years is unrecognizable, but by the same token.

there's so much noise out there now, so much overwhelm. Who do you trust? And so actually think having somebody who doesn't have skin in the game, isn't trying to flog you anything, you know, has, and again, this is where I think actually, you know, working on scientific academic journals is a benefit, right? I go away and I read some of that research, that's what I've been doing for years.

I care about the fact that what somebody is saying can be backed up by scientific evidence. I it's not just hyperbole. So, yeah, I think that's really important. I think genuinely a lot of the time I'm learning alongside my audience, I've got very much kind of growth mindset, I love learning new things. And there are so many...

interesting people with interesting different takes on out there to learn from and you know if I'm interviewing somebody about a book for example I will always read the book so I'm not just gonna kind of go in cold and do a puff piece. I want to have read the book, have something interesting to say about it or at least have some sensible questions to ask them.

Pippa Goulden (07:37)
Yeah. And how do you find the podcast or do you find the podcast brings people into your world from a client perspective, from an opportunities perspective, that kind of thing?

Emma (07:47)
Well, I mean, I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing now without having started the podcast five years ago. And for me, it's opened up amazing opportunities. It's connected me with brilliant people. It's a sort of that network ripple effect of, you become part of the community. You're constantly learning from other people.

Maybe you're going along to event and meeting more people that way. I've also run a newsletter. So I guess people find me that way and stay then in my community through that.

Pippa Goulden (08:26)
But I think, and I think looking at the podcast, because you've done a really great job of building your profile and getting known for what you do. And what is great about your podcast, I talk about this a lot with clients and members and people in my world, using the podcast as a PR tool, not just as a marketing tool. So it's not just a way of saying, look at me, look at what I do, but you're really good at using it to bring in the right people within that world to kind of

have the halo effect on you. You're dancing on other people's dance floors, which we like to say. You know, it works really well as a tool for you from that perspective, doesn't it?

Emma (08:59)
Yeah, and I'm quite choosy about the people that I work with as well. I guess it's one sort of sign of starting to become well known is that you suddenly start getting people pitching. think the first time I got a pitch from someone I was like, oh, hello, what's this? So I do get quite a few now and actually don't go for...

lot of the ones that are pitched to me, I'm much more likely to go and find somebody, either I've seen a book that they're writing and I think they'd be a really interesting guest, but I do sometimes go for pitches but certainly not all of them.

Pippa Goulden (09:43)
No, definitely not. So let's talk about those pictures. Have you got any advice for people that are looking to do more guest spots on podcasts? What would be your tips on that then?

Emma (09:52)
I mean, think the obvious ones are obviously doing your research. I'm sure, you know, other people have said that before and I think there are more and more, companies out there, aren't there that will do the kind of pitching on your behalf. And I'm not always sure sort of how kind of rigorous they are in terms of doing the research for you. But if you're pitching for yourself, then, you know, definitely finding out a bit more about the podcast that you're going to pitch to, you know, look back through.

Who have they spoken to over at least the last year? and have a look at their recent guests. what topics have they been covering? What are the kind of angles? You know, maybe have a listen to one or two if you've got time, just to kind of get a feel for the dynamic. I wouldn't go in completely cold.

And I think if you're depending on what it is that you're pitching, just because somebody's done something similar before doesn't mean there isn't an in road for you, but you need to be bringing something different. no podcaster wants to be kind of putting out two episodes saying essentially the same, the same kind of thing. So what's, yeah, what are you bringing to the party? What's your kind of unique take on something?

And then being really, really clear. sometimes what's useful, I think in a pitch is to give people a couple of different options. that might land because it might well be that they don't know what I've got coming up over the next six months. Maybe I've already got somebody lined up to talk about thing one, but thing three on that list.

might be quite interesting. I'm gonna peak my interest and say, okay, yeah, that might work.

Pippa Goulden (11:19)
Yeah, that's good advice. And so you've been in my DIY PR membership. You've also done Get No, which is my six week group sprint. When it comes to your PR, has what surprised you, has anything surprised you about doing it yourself?

Emma (11:32)
I think, and you you do a really good job of sort of myth busting and kind of demystifying a lot of this. I think if you're kind of coming to it completely cold, you probably think about PR as, you know, getting featured in the Sunday time supplement or something, but it's more than just one thing. There's lots of different ways that you can PR yourself.

just kind of, guess, understanding that it's not just that sort of narrow route and sort of thinking, thinking creatively, I think, about what PR can look like. But also I think maybe one of those sort of penny drop moments is like, know, journalists are just people like you and me, right? They're doing their job, they're busy. How can you make life easier for them? They're only human. You know, don't kind of put them on a pedestal.

Yeah, they're other fellow humans doing their job.

Pippa Goulden (12:21)
Yeah, exactly. That is something, and in the membership we do meet in the media sessions all the time and everyone's always so surprised because they're really nice and normal and just human beings like all of us trying to get their job done. So that's definitely something that I think there's so many myths relating to PR, but that is one of the big ones and that puts you off pitching, isn't it? Because you think that there's some sort of like other special type of person that's different to you.

Emma (12:27)
Thank

Yeah.

and

Pippa Goulden (12:46)
And actually when

you realise they're just normal people like you and me at the end of the email, it kind of really changes that approach to it, I think.

Emma (12:53)
Yeah, and also there's that sort of, you know, why me? Why would they be interested? Like, well, why not you? Of course they're going to be interested in what you've got to talk about if you just need to kind of frame it in the right way.

Pippa Goulden (13:04)
Absolutely. And what's been your, because you've got some lovely bits of PL, is there one favourite that you've had or something that you thought, that's been really good? I'm glad I did that.

Emma (13:14)
I mean, as a woke lefty or being in the guardians always gonna kind of be up there. I've just recently actually had a pitch accepted by a really well-known publication. So, I mean, I haven't even written the article yet, but I think that was, that's exciting. Watch this space. I'm not gonna say cause I'll jinx it, but yeah, I don't know. A couple of years ago, I don't think I would have even dreamt.

Pippa Goulden (13:29)
watch this space everybody.

Emma (13:40)
of responding, it was actually, there was a LinkedIn post with the editorial director of that publication posted on LinkedIn of all places. And I was like, well, what's the worst that can happen? I'm gonna throw my hat in the ring, here's an idea. Are you interested? Turns out, yes, they are. So, you and it's not, and you're not gonna win every one. I think that's the thing as well. Like you've got to kind of get accustomed to knockbacks and kind of.

Pippa Goulden (13:48)
I know the one you're talking about. That's exciting. ⁓

Yeah.

Emma (14:06)
not let it put you off, right? You've got to keep going, keep persevering. And yeah, I think like, I'm sure people will say it's a numbers game, isn't it?

Pippa Goulden (14:14)
Yeah, absolutely. And I think something that you've been really good at, I've noticed is looking at what's going on in the wider context. Obviously, your specialist area is midlife and menopause and you have so much relevant experience of that from all of the breadth of knowledge you have through the podcast and that kind of thing. But you're really good at seeing kind of trends and using those to maybe it's making it the pitch isn't just about you, but it's about what's going on in the wider.

world out there.

Emma (14:43)
Yeah, I mean, I guess that sort of tangential area that I'm really interested in, you know, is, you know, sort of gender equity, the world of work, but also the sort of the fact that we're all living, you know, living longer, we're to be working for longer, the demographic is changing. And so, you know, you can take something like kind of midlife well-being menopause, and it has these kind of

corollary areas of things that it is relevant to. Now those are idea, those are sorry, subjects that I'm interested in anyway. So it kind of doesn't feel hard work to kind of leak into that space. then so I've made a conscious decision to sort of invite people onto the podcast who work in that, you know, sort of field of aging populations, you know, workplaces. How do we kind of get

companies to look at their strategy, sit up and take notice, be aware of the fact that there's rampant ageism going on in recruitment and across industries as a whole, pretty much. And that comes back, I guess, to that idea of following that golden thread of what am I interested in, what am I passionate about? And that's going to

probably keep evolving over time. don't always want to, I don't want to kind of get stuck in just one, one space.

Pippa Goulden (16:02)
Yeah, that makes sense. And everything's evolving anyway, especially in the space that you're in. you the more you can be part of that evolution with it and that helps kind of position you as a go to. But also, I think you've done a really good job of making yourself discoverable. I think you do it through the podcast, obviously, but also your LinkedIn and that kind of thing. And do you find that people come to you now because they want your expert?

expertise around a certain topic or something that you've maybe written about or talked about somewhere.

Emma (16:32)
Yeah, definitely that's taken some time. I don't think that happens overnight. But yeah, and weirdly as well, finding people. So this is another area that I'm quite interested in is AI, but even people. So I had a client call with somebody recently for some corporate work and said, how did you find me? And I like, chat GPT search.

Pippa Goulden (16:36)
It does, yeah.

Emma (16:52)
And yeah, I think things like, you know, articles, obviously writing for blogs, all of that kind of thing kind of helps you be more discoverable, obviously. So the more kind of places you can put yourself, the more you kind of the tentacles find you. And then you kind of, start to go up the ranking, don't you, in terms of popping up when people are searching for something particular.

Pippa Goulden (17:12)
Yeah, yeah,

absolutely. And it's something I'm going to be talking a lot more about actually, because it's becoming more and more important if you want to be searchable through AI. It's kind of a different game to the SEO and the links. You people used to focus a lot on their own websites and the links and all of that kind of stuff. But actually, it's about the authority piece. And that is being featured in the very reputable places.

Emma (17:23)
Yeah.

Pippa Goulden (17:37)
things like having your podcast is gonna help, know, all of that kind of stuff, that really will be making a difference to your, AI search in a different way to the SEO. And I think that's something that we should all be being much more aware of.

Emma (17:37)
Mm.

Pippa Goulden (17:50)
What was I going say next? Oh yeah. So with the PR that you're doing and this kind of piece of getting known for what you do, how do you find that then impacts your business?

Emma (18:02)
I wasn't really sure how to answer that. I mean, I think it's...

Obviously, if we're talking about the menopause side of things, it's quite a crowded marketplace. So, you need to be able to stand out. think there are more and more people moving into that space over time. So, you need to have something that sets you apart from other people in that space. And then...

For me now kind of working in the coaching space, it's kind of, you know, how I'm thinking then again, like how can I position myself in a different space? How can I do that without losing some of the, you know, the kind of the authority that I might have built up somewhere else? So I'm having to think a lot harder about what that kind of looks like.

in terms of that balance. ⁓

Pippa Goulden (18:50)
Yeah.

And I imagine that with the work you've done within the menopause space, I mean, that feeds in really nicely into the coaching side of the business, doesn't it?

Emma (18:59)
Yeah, companies are, I think, picking up much more now on the fact that coaching can be a supportive part of that sort of ecosystem of kind of helping people navigate through this. More kind of research coming out into how menopause coaching can make a difference. More companies out there who are starting to offer that as a...

sort of a specialist area of coaching. So I hope and think that that's going to grow over time. you know, those kind of two bits kind of converging together.

Pippa Goulden (19:31)
Yeah, absolutely. And what would be your advice to people who want to do some PR but don't know where to start? They're kind of a bit worried or a bit nervous about putting themselves out there. Can you remember those days?

Emma (19:42)
Yes, I'm not entirely sure that's completely gone. I mean, I think...

Pippa Goulden (19:43)
Hahaha

Emma (19:45)
Well, obviously, you've got some great resources, not least this podcast. So having maybe just sort of setting some small goals to start with. know, whether that's I'm going to, I'm going to learn one thing a week and I'm going to try and implement one thing from what I've learned. Don't try and go out and eat the whole elephant at once, right? You're just going to get completely overwhelmed.

I think I'll stuff it and go and eat crisps on the sofa. you know, start small, I think, and kind of figure out, okay, it might take me a while to get comfortable with this. What do I feel comfortable with? I, you know, maybe I'm gonna go and pitch something to the local newspaper or, you know, my local BBC radio station, whatever. But also kind of do push yourself a little bit out of your comfort zone, because that's how we grow.

So maybe those two things are slightly odd, I think, don't try and do it all at once, but do just try and each time move yourself a little bit forward out of your comfort zone and do something that's slightly scary, right? That's how you kind of get those emails that go, right, okay, blimey, yeah, they said yes. And then it's like, okay, now I'm gonna have to do something about that. But that's okay, we don't have to have it all kind of figured out, we can learn as we go.

Pippa Goulden (21:00)
Yeah, absolutely. I remember, I think it was quite early on in us, we've known each other for quite a few years now, but I think it was quite early on in us. I don't even know if we were working together at the time, but you had an idea of doing a menopause event, didn't you? And you just reached out to some high profile menopause names and they all said yes, didn't they? And you were like, I'm putting up this event now because they've all said yes to me.

Emma (21:16)
Hmm.

I of wasn't expecting them to say yes.

Yeah, and again, sometimes things might work, sometimes they might not. You kind of, take a bit of a gamble on things and yeah, that was a book event with Blackwells and I was quite chancy. I got in touch with the guy who ran events at Blackwells and pitched an event and they were like, oh yeah, brilliant. We'd love to do that. So you just never know.

Pippa Goulden (21:47)
But exactly, and also what people forget is that you're actually often helping people to do their job. So you you think, God, why would they ever want me to do an event there? And then they're like, yeah, brilliant. You're gonna bring people to our space. You're gonna organize it for us, you know, it's win-win. Exactly, so yeah, I think you have to take a bit of a leap of faith sometimes, don't you? And like you say, try things.

Emma (21:52)
Hmm.

Yep, fill a gap in our calendar.

Pippa Goulden (22:10)
something that's really freeing and I say this quite a lot but is no one is watching your business like no one's thinking ⁓ I wonder if Emma's going to you know succeed at that like if it didn't work out the only person that would have known is you and that's quite freeing isn't it?

Emma (22:17)
Hmm.

Yeah, it's kind of like, you know, yesterday's chip paper stuff, isn't it? It's like, well, you might kind of agonize and dwell on it for a couple of weeks, but everyone else has moved on. you know, yeah.

Pippa Goulden (22:36)
Exactly. We need to send the fucking email, don't we Emma?

Emma (22:39)
Absolutely, because you never know where it might get you.

Pippa Goulden (22:42)
Tell me three things that you love about your business.

Emma (22:44)
Only three. Okay, no, I'll try and keep it short. So interestingly, obviously part of the work that I do around coaching is helping people look at strengths. And so there's one very well-known tool called CliftonStrengths. So I thought, well, better put myself through CliftonStrengths so I know what I'm talking about. So that, and that was really interesting. And it kind of, it comes out and tells you sort of what your...

Pippa Goulden (22:46)
Well, as many as you want!

Emma (23:09)
top five strengths are, you know, how you can play to your strengths. And, you know, we can use those kinds of tools in coaching. So, and none of that was really, I guess, a surprise to me, but it's always an interesting exercise. I promise you there's a point to this ramble, but it, but what, you know, some of the things that came out of that were about connecting and about learning. And I think those are two things that are really important to me, you know,

The first one around learning is that kind of growth mindset. You know, one of the joys of being your own boss, right, is you can kind of go after those things that kind of light you up or, you know, I can get off and I can read that, you know, scientific journal article about, you know, Alzheimer's and menopause and hormone therapy. you know, go down that rabbit hole, you know, go read that coaching book. Fantastic. Big pile of books waiting to be read. We won't talk about that. But the other thing is, is about

not just connecting people, spend a lot of time on LinkedIn going, you should talk to so and so, but being connected myself. I think, you know, through the people that I have met in the podcast, the people I've met through, you know, sort of business networking with other female founders, you know, I suddenly have this amazing.

network of connections and that's such a joy and I kind of I guess I look back to my corporate days and kind of you know lovely people that I worked with but it was quite a sort of contained space and now I feel like it's so much more kind of expansive and it just goes off on all these wonderful tangents here there and everywhere so actually there was only two things so what else what's my third

Pippa Goulden (24:40)
Yeah.

Emma (24:43)
Freedom and flexibility, think, you know, those are kind of, you know, that, you know, I can have my dad round for lunch on a Friday. He's got, you know, he's a full-time carer for my mum. He has two hours of respite on a Friday. So, you know, if I want to go and have lunch with my dad on a Friday, I can do that. I'm here, you know, my kids, they're a bit older now, but I'm here when they're home from school. They can ignore me after I've done the, you know, the whole, how was your day? But I know.

I'm here if they need me and for me at this point in life that's just so valuable.

Pippa Goulden (25:16)
Yeah, absolutely. It's so important to just remind ourselves why we're doing this sometimes, isn't it?

Emma (25:21)
Yeah.

Pippa Goulden (25:21)
ask you from your experience within the kind of menopause, perimenopause world, a lot of women get to that stage, they? And they start kind of, the doubt comes in, the anxiety, the questioning. And I think as an entrepreneur sometimes that can be really hard because you may actually be in that phase of being fairly early on in your business or maybe not even fairly on in your business, but you know, being an entrepreneur who needs to put themselves out there and go for it.

Emma (25:32)
you

Pippa Goulden (25:48)
So what's your kind of insight from that perspective around putting yourself out there and doing things that, you know, maybe you might have done more easily before, but there's something going on there that is holding you back.

Emma (26:02)
That's such a good question. a few things. think A, knowing it's not just a you thing. Lots and lots and lots of people going through perimenopause feel like this at one stage or another. And it's not going to last forever.

Sorry, brain fog. Moment. Case in point.

Pippa Goulden (26:18)
I can

delete that bit but I think it's very relevant.

Emma (26:22)
Even menopause experts get a fog, it's fine. But I was trying to give a really proper, considered response to this. And I think it's so hard because, and part of that is because it's so individualized and we are all so different and our personal circumstances are so different.

And it's hard, it feels hard because it's hard. It's not, it's not that you're doing it wrong or that there's something wrong with you. And whether that's, whether that's the entrepreneurship bit or the perimenopause bit, it feels hard because it is hard. But we will get through this. And one book that I always recommend to people is the, Menopause Brain by Dr. Lisa Mosconi, which is really very accessible. She's one of the, one of the top.

kind of experts in terms of research into women's brains, particularly around menopause and things like Alzheimer's disease. And all of the longitudinal research that she has been doing for years shows that there is a bounce back. The vast majority of people, whether it is the brain fog or the confidence.

And what I love now about the sort of the menopause conversation is we're getting people now talking more about that what comes next. The after bit, right? After you've got through the baptism of fire or whatever it is, the really tough bit. you know, the people talk about this, you know, feeling so different out the other side, feeling calmer, feeling more assured, more resilient, more empathetic.

And I think that's really, really important that we say that to people, right? You know, there is good stuff coming on the other side. Hang in there, you know, do what you need to do to kind of get through this in good shape. Look after yourself, give yourself time to feel the feelings, to kind of, take a bit of time for yourself if you need it. Don't kind of, I think that's that sort of whole hustle, hustle, push, push, push. We're gonna kind of.

But actually a lot of the time, Perry Mendenpauw is saying to you, just step back a bit, give yourself a bit of space and grace and damn it woman, learn how to rest.

Pippa Goulden (28:24)
Yeah.

Yes, I'll mentor that. think it's so important. And I would say from my own personal experience is surrounding yourself with other women, whether it's in the workspace, like we've met through business networks and that kind of thing, but where you're surrounded by women who get it, it's not really in those groups necessarily to grow your business or find clients. It's actually within the entrepreneurial space. There's so many.

Emma (28:41)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Pippa Goulden (28:56)
different groups where you can find your tribe and I think it's a really great way to find that support network of people who just get it and that is really powerful.

Emma (29:06)
Yeah, and I think being vulnerable and open about the times that we're struggling because then it kind of opens a door for other people to go, I'm so glad you said that, you I'm really struggling with that too. It's so, I interviewed an artist called Sarah Gregory who painted these fantastic sort of self-portraits of her, you know, the symptoms that she was experiencing as she was going through perimenopause. And the first time that she exhibited them,

Pippa Goulden (29:09)
Hmm.

Emma (29:30)
you know, lots of her friends came along and they, for the first time, had conversations about their experiences of menopause. it's like, God, it shouldn't take your friend, you know, to have a three foot tall picture of them struggling with kind of hot flushes or insomnia. go, actually, you know, I'm struggling. Like we can, you know, and I see that with, you know, with other people, it's like you, you give people permission to also be vulnerable and to admit if...

they are struggling.

Pippa Goulden (29:59)
gosh, yeah, mean, I could talk to you about this all day. Tell people about how to find you and different ways of working with you.

Emma (30:02)
Hehehe.

Yeah, so I have not made my life easy by having several websites and maybe need to do something about that. ⁓ if you would like to come and work with me as a coach, my coaching practice is called the Triple Shift and that is the tripleshift.org. If you want to find out more about my work around menopause, it's managingthemenopause.com.

Pippa Goulden (30:10)
⁓

We'll put them in the show notes.

Emma (30:29)
The podcast is at middlingalong.com or you can search for middling along on your platform of choice, listening pleasure. And I now have a community for women in midlife who are juggling the midlife collision, everything everywhere all at once as I call it, which is called Holding Up The Sky and that is at holdingupthesky.com.

Pippa Goulden (30:49)
Wow, no wonder you're busy! But you know, it's...

Emma (30:51)
Yeah,

I occasionally see my children too and my long-suffering husband.

Pippa Goulden (30:56)
Yeah,

but it's been amazing to watch your journey, for want of a better word, but seeing, you you put these pieces of the puzzle together and how all the bits that you're doing now are like the sum of what you've done before. It's so interesting to watch it and you've done a brilliant job getting known for what you do, getting yourself out there, putting on those big girl pants and sending those emails. So well done. You can have a gold star from a PR perspective.

Emma (31:01)
you

You

Thank you. And hopefully, you know, I guess what I would say to that with people, if you're in that kind of midlife, messy middle bit, go, you can reinvent yourself, right? There are endless possibilities. So yeah, don't settle if you're not happy.

Pippa Goulden (31:40)
Yeah, that is a great one to end on. Thank you so much for coming on PR Made Simple.

Emma (31:46)
thank you for having me.

Pippa Goulden (31:48)
I hope that conversation with Emma has inspired you to go out, take the action to get known for what you do because Emma is a brilliant example of somebody that shows what happens when you do, it absolutely works. And if you want to join my Get Known Sprints, just like Emma did, you have until Friday, we kick off next week. I cannot wait. I've got an amazing cohort for the last Get Known Sprint of 2025.

Or you have my DIY PR membership and my one-to-one accelerator. You can find out everything at theprset.com or follow me on Instagram. I'm Pippa the PR set. DM me, slide into my DM, send me a voice note or I am Pippa Goulden on LinkedIn and I will see you again very soon for another episode of PR Made Simple.